Coconut Oil Does Raise Cholesterol : Great Health Debate Night 1 Snack Bites

Monday Feb 7, 2011 | BY |
| Comments (89)

free coconut oil
Free coconut oil here.

The Great Health Debate has started with a pretty big splash…

Overall, there was a lot of information covered and a very complete analysis would take days to write.

So for each of these evenings, I’m going to pick and write on 5-7 points that I thought were interesting, needed more clarification, were wrong, or were valuable takeaways from the event.

I’m going to call them “Snack Bites.” :-)

Keep in mind, I’ll be writing these in a way so that if you did not get a chance to listen to the call, you will still learn a thing or two!

Here we go…

1. Confirmed: Coconut oil increases cholesterol.

Everyone wants to lower their cholesterol, it seems, but the raw food and vegan subgroup tend to have issues with cholesterol being too low.

Dr. Gabriel Cousens and Dr. Mercola both confirmed that coconut oil will increase cholesterol. This is good news for those vegans or raw food eaters who tend to have low cholesterol and need to boost it to help produce necessary hormones.

Dr. Cousens warned that a large percentage of live food vegans who come to him are suffering from depression which is linked to hormone imbalance that starts with lack of cholesterol.

If you’re on that path and do have depression, you might want to check your cholesterol levels and see if they’re below 150 or so. If they are, you may want to consider working on bringing your levels up so your body can produce the feel good hormones it needs.

2. Are raw egg whites good for you?

Dr. Mercola spent some time talking about raw eggs and their protein content. Dr. Cousens confirmed that they were a good source of protein, but also stated that they were spiritually draining.

One of the questions that we didn’t get to was whether or not we should be concerned about some of the nutrient inhibitors in raw egg whites.

Raw egg whites contain avidin which is a protein that inhibits the absorption of biotin or (Vitamin B7.) If you cook the egg whites, the avidin is deactivated and you then can absorb the biotin.

There have been one or two studies that have shown those who eat raw egg whites have shown a decrease in biotin over time in humans, so this may be valid.

On the flip side, were the subjects in this study eating other foods with biotin in them as well, or were eggs the only source?

If they weren’t eating many other foods that do contain biotin, which aren’t mentioned in the studies, then we can only conclude that raw egg whites do cause biotin deficiency IF you don’t eat much else with biotin.

Basically, they are not exactly conclusive.

I’d like to get more clarification from Dr. Mercola about what he’s found about this.

3. My question about l-carnosine wasn’t answered.

The biggest question I had about the amino acid l-carnosine that Dr. Cousens was explaining to be a very good supplement for longevity and to assist with vegans and their dietary needs was this:

“What are the symptoms of over use?”

When I asked this question, it got lost in the shuffle, but I think it’s an important one to address.

Taking isolated amino acids like l-carnosine may help, based on Dr. Cousens’ clinical study, but it may also – in the long run – prove to be more harm than good.

I don’t know what the answer to this dilemma is, but it’s important to look into it.

Other isolated amino acids and amino acid combinations can be toxic. Aspartame is a perfect example.

Aspartame is a mixture of the amino acids – aspartic acid and phenylalanine. When they’re broken down in the body they cause many acute issues including diarrhea and dizziness as well as long term issues like MS, hearing loss, memory loss and more.

Can l-carnosine do the same thing?

Likely not, but we do need to be careful with high doses of just about anything for extended therapeutic use.

The use of l-carnosine causes the body to produce an enzyme that breaks it down. I would like to know, over time, if the production of that enzyme creates some deficiency that will unbalance the body.

For me, I’m not about to jump on the wagon and take l-carnosine – even with the evidence of Dr. Cousens’ work. I want to do more of my own research and ask around to see if anyone else knows more or has been using it as well.

4. Body constitution does need to be explained more.

We ran out of time to talk about this more.

In events like this, you can’t get to everything.

I wanted each to explain this topic further, but other questions got in the way.

If you want you can go to Dr. Mercola’s website and take the nutritional typing test and see for yourself where you stand. This will give you a better understanding of how your body works and if you function better using body typing guidelines or not.

I will do my best to either have one of them, or someone else explain it on a future Renegade Health program.

I wish I had asked a question about body constitution instead of this question…

5. What are the implications ecologically and ethically about eating local foods?

I asked both Dr. Cousens and Dr. Mercola about the ethical and ecological issues of getting supplements from all over the world.

When I asked this question, I wanted them to discuss all the ethical and environmental considerations of getting eggs from a neighbor’s back yard versus ordering coconut oil from a factory (even if it is an organic) farm in Central America to help raise your cholesterol.

I wanted to know which seemingly to them was a better choice for the planet.

The discussion I would have wanted would have gone like this…

In this case, eggs are relatively low in terms of environmental impact, but the coconut oil is high since you have to use a lot of fuel to get that oil to you.

Strike one on coconut oil.

On an animal rights / ethical standpoint, there is an argument as well.

What’s the amount of destruction to animal life comparatively?

Raising chickens doesn’t fit into the vegan philosophy because of its exploitation of animals.

But does clearing acres of jungle to put up an organic coconut plantation fit into a vegan philosophy as well? How many animals are exploited here? How many died?

Finally, when looked at in a holistic way – which choice is better for your health, the globe and all living beings?

Anyway, maybe all of us can have this discussion here on the blog. Please post your thoughts!

6. There are no meat-eating healing centers that I know of.

Dr. Mercola confirmed that he didn’t know of any place where people go to heal that has meat on the menu.

I do not know of a place either.

This, in itself, is very good evidence that for healing illness removing these types of foods from your diet may be effective.

Of course, each individual is different, but throughout the world, healing centers focus on plant foods for healing illness, not on steak and eggs.

I think we can safely conclude that if you need to heal or detox (in most cases), you need to remove the animal protein from your diet for at least a specified time.

7. No chair throwing tonight or any night from here on out…

Of course there was no chair throwing or body slamming last night.

I wouldn’t allow it.

For those of you looking for confrontation like that, your best bet is to watch some Jerry Springer reruns or Jersey Shore instead of this one!

Let me ask you a question…

How many times have you found common ground with someone while you were arguing with them?

I know, me neither.

Each expert deserves a chance to speak their mind in a way they feel is the best way to convey their points.

They’ve been asked to prepare as best they can to make sure this happens.

In order to make sure that they can address some of the more difficult questions without this type of confrontation each expert will speak separately from here on out until the last night. They will all be asked similar questions so that we can put all the serious topics on the table in a way that is educational, not reality TV.

Thanks for reading and participating in the discussion! Be sure to post your comments now!

Also, if you’re not a part of the debate and want to be click here.

If you want to get the copies of the calls with transcripts, please click here.

**
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We’ll also be adding more as the Debate goes on!

Here’s where you can go now to check out what we have for you:

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Live Awesome!
Kev

Kevin Gianni

Kevin Gianni is a health author, activist and blogger. He started seriously researching personal and preventative natural health therapies in 2002 when he was struck with the reality that cancer ran deep in his family and if he didn’t change the way he was living — he might go down that same path. Since then, he’s written and edited 6 books on the subject of natural health, diet and fitness. During this time, he’s constantly been humbled by what experts claim they know and what actually is true. This has led him to experiment with many diets and protocols — including vegan, raw food, fasting, medical treatments and more — to find out what is myth and what really works in the real world.

Kevin has also traveled around the world searching for the best protocols, foods, medicines and clinics around and bringing them to the readers of his blog RenegadeHealth.com — which is one of the most widely read natural health blogs in the world with hundreds of thousands of visitors a month from over 150 countries around the world.

89 COMMENTS ON THIS POST

Comments are closed for this post.

  1. Julie says:

    The question I had for Dr. Mercola, which I thought you were trying to get at, Kevin, when you asked about toxicity of animal protein, was: What about the body’s response to those partially-broken down chains of amino acids from eating animal protein? My understanding has been that these substances (aren’t they called called peptides?) become additional toxins in the body, because the body only recognizes and properly recombines individual amino acids.

    I hope this was clear.

  2. Loved the debate last night. Respect both of these professionals and thought that the questions asked where great(even if not all of them were answered).
    I do not know anything or even heard about l-carnosine but when you start using Aspartame in the same sentence I get really nervous. I believe that Aspartame is one of the worse things out there so I am not sure if I would even touch carnosine.
    Still can’t bring myself to even entertain the idea of eating raw eggs but do like organic cooked eggs. I know that I am not getting all the nutrients from it but think e-coli every time someone wants to eat something raw.
    I am a meat eater but it really says a lot to me when you stated #6, no meat healing centers…very powerful point!
    Can’t wait for tonights talk!

  3. christine says:

    Thank you for the snack bites summary (and for your work pulling this debate together). You covered some of the things I wondered about such as L-carnosine. It is easy to get carried away listening to these expert speakers and think “I need that” when its important to take a step back and think about whether you really do. I am a long term vegetariam, more recent vegan. I am also on a tight budget and don’t have a lot of money to be buying supplement after supplement so must choose wisely. The biggest message I gained from both speakers last night was to pay attention and take care, to not let myself get deficient in the basics such as B12, Vit D and basic minerals.

  4. Debra Stanley says:

    Kevin, Thank you for a very informative debate last night. With respect to toxicity
    of carnosine, it may occur if over 1000mg taken daily. Specific symptoms not indicated. Here is an excerpt from Finnish carnosine supplement manufacturer:

    Adverse side-effects: None. Allergic reaction to carnosine is in theory possible, if over 1000 mg/d is taken.

    ( http://www.biovita.fi/index.php?page=products&id=6 )

    FULL TEXT——:

    What is carnosine?

    Carnosine is well documented scientifically as a nontoxic, natural nutritional supplement. No adverse health hazards have been reported even when used continuously.

    L-carnosine is a dipeptide, formed by two natural amino acids, alanine and histidine. Carnosine was discovered in Russia in 1900 and it has been used as a complementary therapy since the 1930´s but it is the research that has been conducted over the last ten years that has pointed to its outstanding anti-aging properties.

    We know that cells that contain significant amounts to sufficient amounts of carnosine are healthy cells and also the longest-lived cells. The highest concentrations are found in the brain, cardiac muscles and skeletal muscles. Its beneficial biological effects have been proven and documented in established scientific journals. A single dose (450 mg) of carnosine raises serum total antioxidant capacity (Antonini et al. 2002). Carnosine removes heavy metals from the body by chelation.

    Dosage: For prevention 125 mg daily. For complementary therapy and athletes 400 to 800 mg daily.

    Adverse side-effects: None. Allergic reaction to carnosine is in theory possible, if over 1 000 mg/d is taken.

  5. Jolie says:

    Hi Kevin
    I am currently doing the Paleo thing with Malika Duke (Fitrichwoman)…who knows maybe she’ll be the first to start a healing center using meat. Thanks for having this health debate….Malika has advertised it to her followers.
    Jolie

  6. Cici Cummins says:

    Hi Kevin,

    Excellent interview and organization, I’m so impressed and excited about getting these topics and information out in the airwaves.

    I also feel gratitude for the respectful, drama-free manner in which this is taking place.

    Thank you!

    About the coconut oil. I didn’t realize that jungles were clear-cut to create coconut farming. Of course all the petrol fuels to bring the oil to me is a stress on the planet.

    Spiritually, I’ve been taught that eggs do inhibit spiritual progress in meditation and incur karmic debt unlike plant-based or even a lacto-vegetarian choice.

    Needing cholesterol to function as optimally as possible (to relieve depression for vegans etc) is a legitimate human need and so my opinion is to create avenues as supply with the least impact/footprint.

    I think no loss of animal life is the best avenue yet as you mention, creating a farm where there was once a wild area–to create coconut farms–will harm wildlife.

    I would hope to lessen the impact on wildlife and create corridors around the farm. For those whose spiritual path does not prohibit eating eggs from local farms, that’s a good option.

    For those whose spiritual path requests omitting eggs and all flesh foods, I think that’s, as in my case, a huge need.

    I had been getting shipments of coconut oil from the Phillipines which was in my understanding a native and wild growing crop there.

    Obviously, as you point out, studies and action need to be taken on how to supply more people who need coconut oil without harming eco-systems and animals.

    Corridors could be a partial solution.

    Blessings Kevin and AnneMarie!

  7. Jude Manche says:

    I enjoyed the discussion last night very much. Gained much useful information and better insight into the differences and similarities between the two points of view. Also feel that stuff that I knew or didn’t know before hand made more sense to me. Hearing these two drs separately before did not make as much sense to me. Being a person who is overweight I was a bit surprized at the mention that overweight people would not be listening. I expect there would be quite a lot of people who have weight issues for more reasons than pure diet & exercise. Weight is not just an issue about food – believe me I have been 100% raw for a year, been vegan and am vegetarian, exercised at the gym and walked. Anyway I wont go into that except to say that I expect there were more people listening with weight issues than they seemed to think. People on a journey of discovery and change at a cellular level and spiritual level. I’m sure a lot of Rawfood Rehabbers were listening and if you check out their website you will find a lot of overweight people trying to improve their lives

  8. Donna says:

    I have a small flock of 8 chickens in my back yard. They are happy, free roaming and not being harmed in the slightest. Chickens lay eggs and leave them there to . . . well . . . rot I guess. What is the exploit to the chicken if we eat their unfertilized egg??

  9. Re: Carnosine, I agree that it makes sense to wonder whether there could possibly be any as yet unknown negatives to supplementing with it in high doses, but given that it is a natural substance that is not only found in animal meat but also produced by the human body as well, there is probably no danger in supplementing with it unless one were to take extremely high doses, which is unrealistic from a cost perspective. It is not even sold in very large containers.

    Aspartame, on the other hand, is not found in nature or produced by the human body or by animals. There is no comparison between aspartame and carnosine, they are totally unrelated and are not made of the same things at all, there’s no overlap.

    Life Extension Institute (www.lef.org) has articles on carnosine. It is sold as both a longevity supplement (by minimizing cellular damage due to glycolisation, which affects everyone but especially diabetics and people who eat a lot of sugar/carbs) and as a sports supplement. It is found in the muscles, the brain, and heart tissue. It has been available as a supplement for a long time in places like the Vitamin Shoppe.

    I don’t know whether it’s something a vegan would actually “need” to supplement, since humans appear to be able to produce it ourselves, but taking it in supplement form does appear to have certain benefits both in terms of slowing aging and as a nutrient for the brain and muscles.

    I have read elsewhere that studies have found it to be helpful in the treatment of autism, perhaps because it can help to chelate (remove) heavy metals.

    -Martin

  10. hyesun says:

    thanks so much for this debate! i just finished listening to it and enjoyed it. i’m looking forward to the rest of it.

    about healing centers using meat: gerson used to use raw liver in their healing protocol. i can’t remember why they stopped.

    also, i’ve been taking carnosine for the last couple months on the recommendation from dr. al sears, a naturopathic anti-aging MD whom i respect and whose literature i’ve been reading. he recommended that carnosine be one of the few supplements that people take. and then i read about the benefits of carnosine in Life Extension Magazine, which i subscribe to. here’s an excerpt from their website:

    Long-lived cells such as nerve cells (neurons) and muscle cells (myocytes) contain high levels of carnosine.28 Muscle levels of carnosine correlate with the maximum life spans of animals. Carnosine is a naturally occurring antioxidant that has been shown to be an anti-glycating agent.29-35

    This nutrient also has the ability to suppress formation of advanced glycation end products (AGEs) and reactive oxygen species (ROS), culprits in metabolic dysfunction and oxidative stress that can lead to age-related conditions.25 Carnosine levels decline with age. Muscle levels decline 63% from age 10 to age 70, which may account for the normal age-related decline in muscle mass and function.36

    Since carnosine acts as a pH buffer, it can keep on protecting muscle cell membranes from oxidation under the acidic conditions of muscular exertion. Carnosine enables the heart muscle to contract more efficiently through enhancement of calcium response in heart myocytes.37

    Aging causes irreversible damage to the body’s proteins. One underlying mechanism behind this damage is glycation. Glycation involves the cross-linking of proteins and sugars to form non-functioning structures in the body. The process of glycation can be superficially seen as unsightly wrinkled skin. Glycation is also an underlying cause of age-related neurologic, vascular, and eye problems.38-49 Carnosine is a unique dipeptide that can interfere with the glycation process.29-35

    thanks again kevin, you are awesome!!!

  11. Kasey says:

    I love these events. It’s plain fun to learn new things.

    I think a lot of vegans will start eating meat again after this debate if not after this first discussion! And a lot of meat eaters may cut back or quit altogether. We may all end up more confused than we began, but it’s all a part of the journey to health.

    Depending on individual genetics, to be a vegan, you may need to supplement with: B12, L-carnosine, EPA/DHA, Vitamin D, and Vitamin A?

    I never even heard of carnosine until I read Primal body primal mind, and then again in the link you sent us to Dr. Cousens letter to Dr. Mercola. Very interesting stuff!

  12. Mila Ilina says:

    Wow thanks Kevin, I’m really impressed with the quality of this event! Great idea in providing a summary as well.

    For some reason I thought Dr. Rick Dina once mentioned that cholesterol does not exist in the plant kingdom?! Maybe I heard it elsewhere.. in either case, looks like I may need to get caught up on that. I’m hoping you have a video on cholesterol and coconuts.

    On the ecological implications of local vs. not, I definitely think local is ALWAYS best. The chickens at our local CSA farm are very well cared for, in every ethical regard.. I’m glad you brought that up! It’s a very relevant point to consider, vegan or not.

    Looking forward to tonight’s interview!

    -Mila

  13. John Coté says:

    Hi there Kevin-

    I am a little confused with Dr. Cousins recommendations on diet, particularly in dealing with Diabetes.

    Last night on the phone call he recommended a very low carbohydrate, high fat, high protein diet (foods such as avocado, nuts, etc to provide the fats, protein, and omega oils).

    After the show, I was watching his documentary Simply Raw- Reversing Diabetes in 30 days, and he says that the ideal diet for healing diabetes is a “high fiber, high carbohydrate, low protein low fat diet”(quoted directly from the documentary).

    Did anyone else catch this strange disagreement?

    Thanks in advance,
    John.

  14. Howard Veit says:

    I took Dr. Mercola’s body type test. I am a vegan. Many of the questions relate to how your body reacts to different kinds of foods, what you crave, what you eat for meals, etc.

    It seems to me that if you start from the premise that an individuals current food habits determine their ‘body type’ regarding nutrition, you have started with the wrong premise. Most of us have cravings, Dr. Fuhrman calls it ‘toxic hunger’ that are determined by habits developed over a lifetime. Once we wean ourselves off of cravings for salt, animal fat, and refined sugar, as examples, our whole constitution ‘nutritional body type’ changes.

    If I had taken Dr. Mercola’s test before I became a vegan, I would bet my resulting profile would change. The reason such a small percentage of people, according to Dr. Mercola, are ‘veggie’ types is because most of the people taking the test still have toxic hunger for western diet foods, especially salt, animal fat and refined sugar. If you have those hungers you will feel anxious and depressed when they are taken away. If you wean yourself off of those hungers, you will feel just fine going without.

    The test seems to reinforce unhealthy eating habits, and falsely concludes that most people should remain meat eaters.

    I am not convinced that the body type theory has validity.

  15. Howard Veit says:

    To go further, I don’t think we are born to be vegans, or meat eaters, or whatever. The way we eat is culturally determined. If the culture leads us to an unhealthy diet, it takes work to wean ourselves off of unhealthy foods and onto healthy ones.

    Body typing seems to me to be a cop out. It’s like the gene theory. In other words, we are born to eat a certain way, therefore it is beyond our control to change.

    Changing from a standard American diet to a vegan diet takes commitment and motivation. As Dr. Cousens pointed out, he only ran into one person in his practice who didn’t do better, health-wise, on a vegan diet.

    Maybe some personality types can’t make the switch to a vegan diet, but I don’t think it relates to body type of genetic makeup.

  16. Janet Jagg says:

    I have read several hundred books on every aspect of health. The very best book I have ever read on diet is “The Metabolic Typing Diet,” by William Wolcott. I am a very high fat, protein person. There is a fantastic set of questions at the beginning of the book that helps you determine your metabolic type. Also there is a most excellent chart that is a line graph later in the book showing how people can be anywhere from a very high carbohydrate type to a very high fat protein type. The mixed types can be in the middle or more toward the carbohydrate or protein ends of the spectrum. One thing the questions showed me is that very high fat, protein types relish food. Totally true for me! As such, their is no way I am going to give up my butter, Alaskan Salmon and organic dark meat chicken and get my protein from spirulina which I’ve tried and it is horrible tasting.

  17. Irina Saibeni says:

    Thank you, Kevin for your hard work and high level of professionalism while putting this debate together! Thank you for your after event notes and summaries. You are a marvel!!!

  18. Christine says:

    Hi Kevin,
    Thank you for the great summary. The debate was awesome too. I hope that debates like this could be seen often.

    I have a few questions:
    1. A question regarding supplements.
    What kind of supplements should an adult have daily if the person eat a quite balance diet.

    Would grape seed tablets be great for anti aging? Or would wheat grass powder be superior for your body?

    2. A question regarding water
    Would it be okay to still wash your clothes and dishes but drink and shower with non-chlorinated water?

    3.Is drinking a glass of water everyday upon rising up (first thing in the morning) with 2 tablespoon of lemon good for your health? Will this detox the body?

    Thank you so much in advance…

    Christine

  19. Jan says:

    Great Debate Kev. Great info to chew on. Thanks for asking about Vitamin B12. I am still looking for a Vegan B12 and other B complex. Is your patch Vegan? How about your Vitamin D is this vegan? I hope my brain doesn’t loose any muscle in the interim while we figure out the need for L-carnosine or not.
    Had a bit of trouble hearing Dr. Mercola at times. Don’t know if this was a tech problem or my hearing. LOL! This is very interesting and raises more questions which I feel is great. BTW you have some very informative listeners blogging. Congrats to all who are taking steps to learn and grow. Thanks to all the Dr’s. and Specialists. I’m truly thankful to you & love your snack bites they explain things I missed. Love and Gratitude, Jan.

  20. Sue says:

    Great talk but I’m not convinced that there are vegan and omnivore constitutions to that drastic extent. Its difficult to get all your nutrients with a vegan diet – takes a lot of planning.

  21. Great stuff Kevin…so great. I wish Dr Cousens would have brought up his issues with dairy while Dr Mercola was still around to discuss! Dr Cousens seemed so agreeable while they were together and then totally went off on topics after the “debate” ended. The argument against milk due to radioactive fallout seems well-meaning, but is there any proof of this?
    Im really excited for tonight as well…thanks so much for bringing this to the public.

    And Im so happy that you are considering the effects of agriculture on wildlife…this is the biggest point that conscious eaters miss…those amber waves of grains and fields of veg were once vast forests teeming with life. Thanks for bringing that issue up.

    Anthony

  22. Brian says:

    Friends,

    Howard V makes some excellent points. How do we sort out the true needs from the false cravings? When I sort that out, I will have the answer to more than my dietary questions.

    I took the typing test and came out mixed like most who test.

    Despite that, I am a mostly organic raw vegan, but I cheat occasionally with cooked veggies and eat a looser vegetarian diet when I travel which is often.

    What bothers me is if we are meant to be vegan, where’s the B12? And why is the protein and other micro-nutrients so tough to come by.

    For me is a matter of discipline and cleansing. I don’t for a minute believe a diet will cure anything, but I agree w Gabriel than the vegan life is the low toxic way to go, so I stick with it,. And take extra B12.

    Be well. We are all in this together

    Brian

  23. Ronald says:

    John, I think “high” carbohydrate was a mistake – should have been “low.”

    Howard, I too took the nutritional typing test. I don’t believe it has any validity. Some of the questions didn’t make any sense to me.

  24. mindy says:

    I loved the civility and mutual respect in the interview. The tone was set. I loved hearing the two doctors have a discussion with each other, and then you, Kevin went on to interview each separately. It is a treasure to observe, hear the convesation between two experts. I hope you will not give that up.

    And yes there are healing centers that serve meat. I have not studied this deeply, but I went to one in Austria, based on the work of Mayer, called VIVA MAYR. They focus on local food which includes small portions of fish (smoked) local cheese, beautiful local oils (pumpkin, flax, hemp). These are clinics that relate to the work of this early healer who actually studied about HEALTH not just disease. It is fascinating.

    And I don’t know if there is a center related to weston price’s work. Does anyone know? Maybe Sally Fallon knows.

    Important not to assume no centers of healing where meat is served. Healing has been something humans have saught for centuries.

    Thanks for all you do.

  25. James Kahan says:

    Great work Kevin! You are such an inspiration.

    I agree i would love to see more info on body constitution/ body typing/ metabolic typing as this seems to be a consistent theme in many of the world leaders of health and nutrition.

    My personal stance on local food vs. shipped supplements such as coconut oil is that all things being nutritionally equal, local foods win every time. I think we can get really picky about the trace substances that we need from these exotic food supplements, when for the most part, everything we need in the western world can be sourced locally. Having said this, i have a half liter of coconut oil right here in my kitchen! Doh…..

    I think the reason why there are no meat based healing centers is because a raw vegan diet is universally recognized as the best diet for total body detoxification. Even many of the gurus who promote a meat based diet, like Paul Chek and Charles Poliquin, have stated that going vegan is the best way ton detoxify the body. If anything, the proliferation of healing centers using a vegan diet, shows that the one of the greatest threats to the world’s health is toxicity itself. Maybe if more of the worlds population was eating vegan/veggie we would see more meat based healing centers?

    Thanks again for putting on this wonderful event.

    Best Wishes,

    James.

    ps. I would love to see Paul Chek on your show!

  26. Howard (posts #15 & 16), I think you raise an interesting point. I don’t think body typing is completely invalid as you suggest, but I think we can transition our bodies towards a particular diet if that diet is nutritionally complete and we are willing to go through the necessary transition. When someone adopts a lighter, healthier diet, especially a raw plant-based diet (or does a fast or cleanse of some sort), emotional issues come up, including things that may have previously been suppressed in the subconscious mind. THIS IS SUCH A MAJOR ISSUE THAT IT DESERVES CAPS FOR EMPHASIS.

    This may be unpleasant and might cause one to feel like crap, but based on my own experience and that of many others, this is actually healthy process. If one is willing to go through with it, including allowing oneself to experience the negative emotions, and perhaps do a little bit of soul-searching or emotional healing (possibly including making certain changes in one’s behavior or lifestyle or relationships if necessary), then one can ultimately get rid of the negative emotions.

    This might require a certain degree of openness, and openmindedness, that many people might not be ready for, and it might be especially difficult if one is not in a supportive environment. The “body type” argument can then provide a convenient excuse to eat more animal food or “comfort food.” I do think there is probably also an element of inherent “body type” as Dr. Cousens and Dr. Mercola both believe, but I think it’s a much smaller element than people think it is; we are inherently different to some extent, but not as much so as many of us believe.

  27. Mack says:

    Kevin – Last night was wonderful, it really was – I did notice one glaring problem though.
    It was pointed out from the beginning that Dr. Mercola and Dr. Cousens were both clinicians and that was a real strength – I totally agree with that – however, neither spoke as clinicians – Dr. Cousens spoke mainly of his own personal experiences and listed many noted sports figures that were vegans – could these have been the group that responds well to that regimen ? – as opposed to people that do not do well on it ? Dr. Mercola hardly mentioned any anecdotes based on his clinical experience.
    Wonderful night – I learned much – but both speakers missed an opportunity to prove their cases form their clinical experience.
    Thanks again Kevin ! Great job ! :)

  28. Michael says:

    Extremely valuable! What an incredible summary. Great job Kevin and the Renegade Health Team!

  29. Sue says:

    As Ronald mentioned above there is a healing centre that serves meat. I don’t think meat is toxic its just that as a meat-eater it may be beneficial to eat low protein for a week or so to cleanse. When going low protein your body will scavenge any damaged proteins etc.

  30. Stephanie says:

    If animals have carnosine, it must be findable in a non animal source, can’t find any research on these levels in various plants?

  31. Dr. Cousens points out that a raw “live food” plant-based diet is the best for spiritual growth and spiritual connectedness. IT IS MORE THAN MUST A COINCIDENCE THAT THIS DIET ALSO BRINGS US CLOSER TO THE SUBCONSIOUS AND UNCONSCIOUS PARTS OF OUR MIND. This can be psychologically and emotionally difficult, especially if one tries to go too fast and is unaware of what is going on and doesn’t have any support; and it can be subtle in the sense that one may not realize that the reason one is feeling a certain way is because THOUGHTS FROM ONE’S SUBCONSCIOUS MIND ARE SEEPING INTO ONE’S CONSCIOUSNESS, whether one knows it or not.

    After I started experimenting with a raw vegan diet and fasting, largely out of curiosity, I joined a group led by a terrific coach named Amy Rachelle (www.amyrachelle.com), who trained us and helped provide us with the awareness and support to be able to understand and get through the emotional and spiritual awakening aspects of eating a raw plant-based diet and practicing periodic fasting. If one wants to do things like transition to a lighter, “cleaner” diet, experiment with fasting, or advance on a “spiritual path,” then finding supportive groups or individuals to do it with is certainly helpful, if not essential; one thing that IS ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL, however, is to at least have the AWARENESS that EMOTIONAL ISSUES ARE GOING TO COME UP, for without that awareness, one is most likely going to conclude that it is simply “not working” or that one’s “body type” can’t handle it or whatever.

    It might be possible that some people’s “body type” might not be compatible with a permanent, long-term, diet that is very low in protein, for instance, but ANYONE can go on a low-protein diet for a period of a few weeks, or go on a fast for a few days or a week – or at least anyone who has the discipline to overcome the temporary food cravings is willing to come face to face with whatever emotional issues come up in the process. The rewards are well worth it.

  32. Dan Hegerich says:

    Hey Sue,

    There are two ways to detoxify-One is by building up deficiencies and the other is by reducing excess(toxicity). From what I learned from the Chinese is that they always first focus on building up deficiencies because most often reducing the excess creates further deficiencies. Yet most centers are focused on reducing excess because people can get a quick fix rather than a lifestyle change. Therefore, eating meat just might be what some requires to build up deficiencies. However, since eating raw meats for 3 years, I do believe that cooked meats completely derail and stop the healing/detoxification process because of the toxins and deficiencies produced from cooking.

    Thinking in terms of finance. If I do not have enough income (deficiency) to purchase shelter,food and clothing no amount of reduction in spending (excess) will help. Generating income (life force) to fulfill those deficiencies would be much more healing.

    Dan Hegerich, 6X Cancer Survivor
    Do The C.U.R.E.

  33. Surprising that this great health debate host does not know of any Meat Eating Healing Center. All he knows are vegan, vegetarian healing centers. Perhaps he hasn’t heard that Max Gerson heals people with raw livers. Perhaps he hasn’t heard about how I cure friends and family with raw meat, raw fat, raw oysters, raw clams, raw fish, raw liver, raw eggs. Well, Mr. Host, I’m here to introduce you to myself and my friend who uses meat eating in healing.

    http://www.myhealthblog.org/2011/02/08/meat-eating-healing-center-in-the-philippines-vander-gaditano/

  34. Brian says:

    There is a meat healing center called Arkadia. It is in Poland and is based on the studies of Dr. Jan Kwasniewski. He wrote the books Optimal Nutrition and Homo Optimus (he has wrote others but these are the only to be translated into english). It basically states that the optimal diet is mostly animal fat, moderate protein, and minimal carbohydrates.

  35. KC says:

    I will have to listen again, but I thought Dr. Cousens was talking about l-Carnitine. Is there some way to improve the volume? I had my volume up to the max and it was still hard to hear without being right on top of the computer.

  36. Patrina says:

    Anthony (#22) don’t forget that the fields (amber waves of grain) grown are not all for human consumption by far! A very major part of agricultural crops are feeding animals for meat eaters :(

  37. bliss says:

    In reference to Dr. Cousens’ use of supplemental carnosine as an anti-aging modiality:

    Latin: carnus or flesh carnivore

    Carnosine is found in relatively high concentrations in several body tissues – most notably in skeletal muscle, heart muscle, and brain. Dietary sources of preformed carnosine include meat and poultry and fish. The average daily intake of carnosine from foods is probably in the range of 50-250mg (based on a diet containing at least one serving, 3-4 ounces, of beef, pork or chicken).

    Meat provides the most abundant natural source of carnosine.

    Also:
    Vegan diet, requires B12 supplementation because it also causes B12 deficiency. B12 is found naturally in animal products.

    6. There are no meat-eating healing centers that I know of.

    Though no “meat-eating” is engaged in, the Gerson Therapy does include the use of crude liver extract, thyroid extract, as well as pancreatin derived from animal sources. “Patients also receive supplements such as thyroid extract, potassium iodide, liver extract, pancreatic enzyme, and niacin.”

    So yes, here is a successful therapy where people can go to a “Healing Center” in which they depend on or utilize meat sources for healing.

  38. Matthew says:

    Every morning I make a protein shake consisting of 2 raw organic free-range eggs, cold pressed organic grass-fed whey protein powder, cocunut milk and almond milk. Sometimes I’ll throw in chia seeds. Since re-introducing more protein from eggs and grass-fed beef, I have never felt nor looked more healthy. I juice everyday and eat high quality veggies. I hardly eat any fruit. Bottom line is that no matter what anyone says – it’s really about their own personal experience and has nothing to do with you. Take it upon yourself to find out what works for you. I fell into the “all vegan, raw food” movement early on as I suspect a lot of us did. I experienced depression, skin problems ,fatigue and more. I personally found out I am a protein type (see Dr. Mercola’s nutritional typing test) and once I re-introduced that back in my diet (50-60%) I have so much energy, and feel great which is why we are all doing this anyway. We can go round after round debating what works and what doesn’t, why you should do this and that but we are all after the same thing – to feel better. So what works for me may not work for you and that’s okay. Let’s not judge each other if one is vegan or one eats meat. Doesn’t mean you are any less spiritual if you eat meat or eggs. That’s nonsense.

  39. Mack (#28), I think Dr. Cousens listed many vegan athletes to make the point that if even athletes – who presumably have higher protein and nutrient needs than others – can thrive on a vegan diet, then others who are not putting as much stress on their bodies should also be able to handle the vegan diet. BUT I think there is an important related point that NEITHER of them brought up, which is that there are two reasons why PEOPLE WHO GET PLENTY OF EXERCISE MAY DO BETTER ON A VEGAN DIET THAN PEOPLE WHO DON’T EXERCISE:

    1) Exercising burns calories, causing you to eat more food, so you are less likely to get deficient in anything.

    2) All animal foods, even organic ones, have a tiny amount of hormones and other things that are inherent to animals (ie, some bacteria, certainly, and possibly other things such as immune cells of some sort that respond to the bacteria, and perhaps things we haven’t discovered or thought about yet); these things can be stimulating to the human body in various ways, so a sedentary person might feel better as a result of this stimulus, but if someone is getting plenty of exercise, their body is naturally getting stimulated and is more likely to be producing all the hormones it needs, especially if the exercise is done on an empty stomach, which promotes the release of human growth hormone, so there may be less need for animal food.

    I am just pointing this out for informational purposes – I don’t think there is anything wrong with eating eggs or other animal products, I think this is perfectly natural for us to do as human beings, but I also realize that there are many who are interested in trying to be vegan or to reduce their consumption of animal foods to a minimum, and for such people, I think it is important to keep in mind that exercising regularly can be very helpful.

  40. jason says:

    According to a UN study, the meat industry creates more carbon emissions than the transportation industry. I don’t know where egg production fits in.

    Knowing this makes it easier for me to choose a non-local plant product, over a local meat product, knowing that not only does it produce less CO2, but also uses less water to produce. It’s not a perfect solution, considering some of the other points you brought up. But, something worth considering and discussing.

  41. Cherie says:

    Great interviews so far. I feel like I have listened to 3 and it was just 1 interview. I had no idea the interviews would be so long. I like the after the interview better than 3 people on the phone at once because most of the time the person speaking can finish their thought that way. Looking forward to tonight, I hope I can get most of it in but if I can not I am glad you are doing the snack bites.

  42. Ivette says:

    Thanks again. Great job! Historic.

  43. Christina says:

    First…… The difference between an isolated compound like Aspartame and L-Carnosine: Aspartame is synthetic. Carnosine (as vegan supplement, in  concentrated form) is naturally occuring & derived from a plant source. 

    Second…… Regarding coconut oil vs. eggs (in terms of locality & sustainability), my opinion: a much better use for rainforest lands that have *already* been clear-cut for beef production is to instead grow organic coconuts. Replacing livestock grazing land w/ coconut trees *in the short term* seems far better ecologically if we (the entire human race; at least the developed world) also check our own population growth so that in the future we do not need to clear-cut rainforests to make room for more and more commercial food production.  

  44. Kathy says:

    I’ve been doing extensive research on candida albicans and one of the bits of info that is relative to this article is that some things are found to be significant in the normally symbionic yeast turning pathogenic in one’s body. One of them is eating raw egg whites. Biotin is important in preventing Dr. Jeckyl from turning into Mr Hyde (c. albicans) and therefore, what you have presented regarding raw egg whites inhibiting biotin makes sense.

    From my research, dissemated Candida can be deadly.More information needs to reach medical doctors and nurses regarding this disease as it is implicated in so many other diseases.

    Love your site.

    Kritts

  45. Sayward says:

    Does anybody have a link to Dr. Mercola’s nutritional typing test? I’m having trouble finding it on his site . . .

  46. Judi Vance says:

    I am really looking forward to hearing all the speakers. I am most concerned with the meat issue. I am allergic to: all vegetables except carrots and zucchini; all fruit except bananas and avocado; all grains; all dairy except butter. I can also eat eggs, fish, and pork. I developed these allergies after 15 years as a vegetarian. Go figure.

  47. Mirella Matotek says:

    As a life long student of healing. I started life as basically a vegan. We were poor and mainly ate what the chickens and garden provided us. Rarely we ate meat. The exception was feast days and special occasions. I absolutely detest beans as they seemed to be the staple food of my childhood. Beans and Greens. No pesticides or fertilisers were used in our garden. The food was clean. I was not an healthy child. Chest infections, conjunctivitis, and eye infections ruled my childhood. Emotionally I was a mess (bipolar). At the age of 14 I was diagnosed with keratoconus – a corneal thinning eye disease. At age 18 I was legally blind and had to undergo a cornea transplant to regain my sight. Throughout my teen years I shunned red meat, ate low carb and low fat. I was also a fitness fanatic. In my 30′s I developed chronic fatigue syndrome that persisted for over 10 years and took a heavy toll on my career and social life. At this point I discovered Weston Price and had also conducted my own research into Retinol (Vitamin A). I had also shunned milk as a child and as a young adult unlike my other siblings. I had convinced myself that I was allergic to milk through reading alternative health literature. In my 40′s I reintroduced fat, cholesterol, red meat and eliminated grains. I experienced a huge health transformation. I am now entering menopause, unlike my other girlfriends, I am not experiencing hot flushes, depression, etc. As an aside my doctor considered me to be extremely healthy in my youth because I was slim, toned, low cholesterol, perfect blood sugar numbers etc.. His remark was – if only the the rest of his patients were so healthy. HEALTHY, why did I feel like crap and didn’t have the energy to live my perfect life. My doctor, now is worried about my health because I have put on weight, my body is still strong, cholesterol levels have increased, but I feel great. No eye issues, No infections, no conjunctivitis. The average life span for a corneal graft is 6-10 years. Mine has survived 30 odd years.

    My mother on the other hand continued eating just what her garden produced. Plenty of vegetables, fruit and eggs occasionally from her chickens. Meat only when I forced her. Her health had always been a issue. At the age of 21 her doctor told me that if I didn’t make sure she stayed on her blood pressure meds, she would have a stroke and not make it to old age. High blood pressure, depression, fibomyalgia, unrelenting fatigue, horrendous transition into menopause, muscle weakness, brain fog, bladder infections, chest infections. Her symptoms get so bad that she convinces herself that she is dying. This is when I take her in to stay with me at my place. I feed her meat, fish, seafood, butter, ghee, eggs etc. I am always amazed that every one of her symptoms disappear. Blood pressure normalises. I have repeated this experiment many times that I am convinced that we simply can not live on vegetables, we need nutritionally dense foods such as animal protein.

    Well I don’t even know why we are having this debate because unlike the time when I was a child, technology and knowledge has vastly improved. We no longer need to guess what sort of diet is right for us. We are fortunate that we have sophisticated instrumentation and tests that can tell us exactly whether we are on the right track. It may still be expensive for many, but not as expensive as having wasted a life because of lack of energy or joy.

  48. Mina says:

    On the “spiritual” point of view, in my island, eggs are used to attract negative energy… and we (some) say that when you eat eggs, it’s opening a door in you to negative energy/entity.

    I found the same statement in some other teachings (and I personally avoid eggs because it would slow me down in my meditation practice)

    And a BIG Thank you for those Snack Bites…

  49. shakti says:

    hello again kevin i posted on your other page – i just finally finished listening to the second conversation with dr cousens – why did you finish so abruptly? it seemed a little ungracious –
    thankyou for getting this forum together -

  50. V.R. says:

    I would like for you discuss any dietary, vitamin or mineral deficiencies that may lead to a loss of smell/taste.

  51. Meghan says:

    Hi Kevin,
    I did not read all the previous comments, so this may have been mentioned. Dr. Cousens said carnotene is a di-peptide, not an amino acid. So it shouldn’t create the problems that can be caused by taking isolated amino acids.
    I liked the debate, but felt that in their commendable efforts to be polite, they did not get into the nitty-gritty as much as they could have. For instance, I have read in Dr. Cousens’ books many worthy rebuttals to the idea that some people need animal products, as Dr. Mercola insists, yet Dr. Cousens did not bring these up…

  52. zyxomma says:

    A couple of years ago, I tried taking Dr. Mercola’s nutritional typing test. There were questions that, as a vegan for decades, I simply could not answer. What kind of turkey meat do I prefer at Thanksgiving? Breast meat or dark meat? My answer was, WTF?! I never eat turkey at Thanksgiving, and haven’t since I was a child. Why would I answer that? The test is fine, if one isn’t vegan. I, however, thought it was a total waste of my time, since I couldn’t answer the questions honestly and finish it.

    I did contact the website with my concerns and disappointments, and got (in essence) a form letter reply.

  53. Tabitha says:

    @Patrina, @Anthony

    The amber waves of grain grown to feed animals are one of the primary reasons eaters of a conventional diet are unhealthy.

    Animals, like humans, did not evolve to eat grain. Unhealthy animals = unhealthy meat eaters.

  54. Judy says:

    My question is on eating raw eggs. I live in thailand and I do not have access to farm fresh eggs in Bangkok and well those certified organic are meaningless. So with no quality assurance, does Dr Mercola still recommend that we eat these eggs raw? They have no doubt been pasteurised.

  55. Chris says:

    @John, yes I too was confused. Since I have seen the Simply Raw movie where he says to eat a high carb diet, why he would say to eat low carb, high protein I don’t really understand.

  56. Parasailing says:

    Health benefits of coconut oil for hair care products, products for skin care, stress relief, maintenance, cholesterol, weight loss, coconut oil is one of the best natural nutrition for hair . It helps the healthy growth of hair providing them with shiny skin. Regular massage of coconut oil head ensures that your scalp is free of dandruff, lice and lice eggs, even if the skin is dry.

  57. bobdinker says:

    Good debate. There are some centers that serve meat(fish) that people go to for healing. The Kushi institute or any other macrobiotic center will have fish on the menu 1 or 2x’s a week. Can’t forget the macro folk when discussing healing.

  58. Ineke says:

    Just want to say that the interview with both of them to me was very “enlightening” I was impressed with the mutual respect the two Doctors have for each other. Also nice to find out that both of them had quite a few things in common (apart from the animal protein versus plant source only) Kevin you did a wonderful job in deciding where you had to come in and where to let the two just do their word. To my mind there was one question where you did not get a clear answer as well and that was when you asked Dr. Mercola whether the body is able to detox animal products properly. (Do I say it right?) At least to me it wasn’t clear.

  59. Karen Toth says:

    Great job putting these calls together!

    Lots of information and inspires more questions for sure!

    I personally try to eat whole, plant based foods and some meet.
    Processed foods are a thing of the past!

    I am on a journey to better health with maintaining anti-aging in mind, body and spirit.

    Sometimes just being grateful and having an attitude of graditude will make life and food much better for my body.

    Love your spirit Kevin!

    Keep sharing your interests!

  60. linda says:

    really disappointed that kevin is removing comments. he said he wouldn’t do this. and i am not talking about hateful useless comments. please stop the filtering. disagreement can provoke thoughtful discussion. silencing is censuring.

  61. Mirella Matotek says:

    Judy Vance, it may be of interest to you that in Australia, we are experiencing an increased incident of allergies to kiwi fruit among children. Go figure.

  62. Lola says:

    Loved the Mercola/Cousens presentation. You did a good job moderating, Kevin! Thanks for all your hard work on this.
    During the “debate” I was thinking of what Dr. Weston A Price discovered in his travels and observation of different people groups. In order to be sustainable each needs to eat local products, and that is different depending on where we live: Arctic? Tropics? I believe what Dr. Price found was that the best diet is freshly prepared (not processed). There are no fruits and veggies growing in the Arctic. So the indigenous eat animal fat and meat…and they are healthy. In the mountains of Peru they eat what’s available…potatoes…LOTS of varieties, but always fresh. If someone chooses to be vegan and that fits their type, more power to them. I bristle a bit when vegans become “holier than thou” on the diet issue, however. Choice IS important. People are different while made of the same “stuff.” Ten years ago I was diagnosed with supra ventricular tachycardia (drastically irregular heartbeat with bouts of HIGH BP!). It all RESOLVED in 3 days by adding fresh omega 3 oil (eaten with soft cheese–following Dr. Johanna Budwig’s protocol) to my diet. It was like a MIRACLE! No more low fat/no fat diets for me. They’re heart killers in my instance. Thanks for letting me have my fats! (smile)

  63. Lynne says:

    When it is said that coconut oil raises cholesterol it was not made clear if this was the ‘good’ cholesterol (HDL) or the ‘bad’ cholesterol (LDL). Which is it? Without this distinction perhaps it is just another blanket statement confusing more people and continuing debate polarization.

  64. Brent Lawrence says:

    Thanks Kev, this is all really exciting even without Jerry S. there is so much confusion obviously in the raw food work and this debate you have put together is going to iron out a lot of those problems:)

  65. Anatol Zinchenko says:

    Thanks Kevin for the debates. I just want to intro a higher perspective that was presented at the World Preservation Foundation Conference last Nov 3 2010 by top world scientists. Basically, it takes 30% of all land surface to grow all the animals for food including tremendous resources of energy, water, air, crops to feed the animals, and large $ subsidies by gov. And at what cost? 80% of Americans suffer the following from animal and processed foods: overweight, obesity, diabetes, cancer, heart, etc etc.

    If everyone all over the world ate like Americans, we would need 3 extra earth planets. This is yet another serious scenario for the extinction of human race. So, to listen to these Neanderthal arguments in favor of animal protein is getting boring… when we know that green vegetables( from local supermarket ) have more protein per calorie than steak. And that superb health of many athletes including Dr Cousens can be had on a plant based diet… and that many are reversing their “incurable” diseases and becoming free of medications… see http://www.fatsickandnearlydead.com

    Thank you Kevin, keep up the good job!

  66. Fountainhead Organic Retreat in Australia
    (www.fountainhead.com.au) is a healing centre that serves flesh. We eat all orgamic, fruit, vegetables – do juice detoxes and predominatly live or raw food but we do cook some and we do serve meat in various ways, (albeit organic, and in small quantities).
    That has not stopped us healing over 4000 clienst over the lst nine years mainmly with stress realted illness, (depression anxiety big 2) but many clienst with a plethora of other illness inlcuding cancer that claiam once the stress was fixed-the illness was too.
    I feel that if we only offered vegetarian programs we would not have had 3/4 of the success stories we have had. Keep up the good work.

  67. Healing Centres that include meat

    From memory, in The Blood Type Diet D’Adamo talks about the Blood Type Diet originating from trials they did at their healing centre where they found some people did better with a diet that included meat whereas previously they had put everyone on a vegetarian diet. Sorry, don’t have a copy of the book with me to check.

    Interesting debate, thanks

  68. Michael T. says:

    Carnosine is not found in plants. It is made in animal bodies. Humans also make it, but our production declines as we grow older.

    This is one reason why younger people can thrive on vegan diets, but as we get older, deficiencies come up more often.

    I was a mostly vegetarian or vegan in my 20s, but now in my 40s I eat more eggs and grass fed meat.

    Also, to clarify, coconut oil does not contain cholesterol. But it allows our bodies to synthesize more cholesterol. Most of the cholesterol in our bodies is not from food, it is made in our bodies, but we need saturated fat for this process.

    Naturally saturated fat, such as coconut oil, is good for us. Someone send a memo to Doug Graham.

    Michael T.

  69. Austin says:

    HAHAHA on the meat-eating healing centers. Sarcasm can be funny when having to deal with ignorant people. You ask them “do you want to live a long healthy life?” & they say “yes” or nothing at all. then you tell them they “have to change some habits” & they say “that is you opinion & not the official medical diagnosis/ recommendation otherwise the general public would be using it..”

    I bet if i told them there was a meat-eating healing center –> then they would want to go. At which point i would laugh hard in there face to further elaborate how little self-control they have. They are one step above babies. Babies eat anything that is solid. Most grown humans eat anything that “tastes good” (highly subjective & addictive), & the rest eat smartly OR super intelligently

    Kevin – think of some more ideas like this that could be used to trick non-healthy eaters into considering a healing path (although the healing path they may be considering could be fake/ to mislead them in the right direction) HAHA. Gotta do it somehow!

  70. Karen says:

    Hi Kevin,

    Did they mention whether it was HDL or LDL that is raised when taking cholesterol? I know mine jumped 14 points on the HDL when i started taking coconut oil and i thought that was good!

    I live in the Philippines and no, we do not cut forests to plant coconut. Coconut plantations here a a-plenty as they are harvested for copra. and here’s a tidbit — there is no plantation (that i know of) that uses pesticides or fertilizers on the coconut plantations (they just wait for harvest time)so to pay premium on virgin coconut oil coming from the Philippines could be unnecessary.

    thanks for putting this together!
    Karen

  71. DavidM says:

    There are also meat healing cancer centers, one of which is mentioned in the book “Knockout”. And the diet is specifically mentioned in the context of differing autonomous nervous systems and balancing the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous systems and how important this is in curing cancer. Well it is also important for overall health and this is exactly what the metabolic typing diet is all about. There is very good science behind this diet.

    Also, it should be mentioned that coconut oil will also lower cholesterol if it is too high. In other words it balances cholesterol. It is misleading to say it only raises cholesterol. It will also balance triglycerides, which has a large effect on balancing cholesterol.

  72. steve meller says:

    Good stuff!I never researched healing centers that include meat, but I will now. I have been to 2 lectures with Aajonus Vonderplanitz and learned of his healing methods with the “Primal Diet”. He has healed himself and many others with this diet.
    Does it work for everybody? Probably not.

    As for Mercola’s Nutritional Typing Test, I believe it is a good starting or reference point just to give you an idea as to where you are now with your diet/eating habits/patterns.
    Like he says, listen to your body.

    I too think that Dr.Cousens should have presented his stronger views with meat and dairy while on the interview with Mercola.
    I do question the validity of radio active fallout onto green pastures.

    I am more concerned with what is being sprayed into our skys everyday and the consequences of it’s fallout !!

    Peace,
    Steve

  73. Rosie says:

    Actually i do know of a center that helps people that DOES eat organic chicken, turkey, fish..(un poquito).

    The Healer is 102 yrs. old is (o blood type).

    he has his food grown in green houses with (hydro-phonics).

    He looks like he’s 70 yrs. young;-)

    He’s a naturepath and a homeopath as well..

  74. Katie says:

    While I am a big fan of a raw diet for myself (or, at the very least, really pushing more fresh produce for everyone) I do think there are healing centers that offer meats – they just aren’t labeled or marketed that way. Any weight-loss center is techinically helping to heal, whether it’s from helping people cut down on processed junk, or just helping lose weight. I interened at Structure House in North Carolina, and they did meats in limited amounts along with everything else. But with the amounts of weight people were losing, they were getting things under control, such as their diabetes and blood pressure, depression and anxiety. So, I think it just depends how you define a “Healing Center.”

    Just wanted to throw that out there :)

  75. Chuck says:

    I’m not sure there is good (or any for that matter) evidence (good scientific) for nutritional typing. I was also concerned by the statement that (and I maybe overstating a bit) that science doesn’t matter – it is the clinical experience that matters. Remember that clinical experience changes – tonsillectomy was a big deal years ago – I’d assume supported by someone’s ‘clinical’ experience.

  76. Ok, so since my last post on this blog posting I had the benefit of listening to NaturalNews365.com’s interview with 2 cancer doctors Dr. Gonzalez and Dr. Linchitz. Dr. Gonzalez actually talked about his practice and the fact that some patients with certain types of cancers (such as lymphoma) do better on a meat diet. So with that said there are some healing centers that do incorporate meat but it is all individual based. Just a note.

  77. Shakti says:

    For those confused by Dr. Cousens low carb statements. I believe he meant carbs from grains. He did say your carbs should come primarily from vegetables. I have used online nutritional logs to track my diet at various times, and if you are eating mostly raw vegetables, you are eating a high carb diet. For example, green leaf lettuce is comprised of about 70-75% carbs, 20-25% protein, and 5-8% fat.

  78. Dave says:

    Kevin very good debate, I’m impressed with the speakers speakers.
    just be careful about meat eating statements…….. as u probably know there are low carb diets that include lot’s of meat- like Atkins diet, not to mention the native Eskimo people that have no choice but eat meat and fat, and they are doing quite well if stick to their diet. They also claim to heal people from many civilisation diseases………….

  79. xplorexpressx says:

    Well! A question for you, Kevin. You are talking about what it cost to have coconut oil coming to our door… but it is the same with olive oil or macadamia nut oil and all the others… unless you agree to go with this ugly canola oil.

    I am living in Canada… and it is cold here, very cold for a big part of the year so… forget about “local” food for almost 3/4 of the year. You do what to feed yourself???? And…. eating “local” is way better, I admit, but…. when you can have organic tomatoes — for example — at 1.99$ a pound in your local store and that you go to the Market and find tomatoes, locally grown, at 4.99$ a pound… not obvious when you are on an extremely tight budget where feeding yourself is an everyday puzzle.

    So, what would you do in this case????… Except to move down south :)

  80. Patrick says:

    Hey what do you guys think about isogenix and other similar supplements ,i don’t like their idea of using it till the end of your life etc.

  81. Shakti says:

    The B12 issue keep coming up, and I am suprised cultured foods haven’t been mentioned. Cultured foods are rich in B vitamins, including B12. Many traditional cultures eat a number of cultured foods. I wonder if people who eat cultured foods have higher B vitamin level, and also if this could be the answer to getting a whole food source of B12 into vegan diets.

  82. Peter says:

    concerning:6. There are no meat-eating healing centers that I know of.

    I’ve studied this Book called Gut and Psychology Syndrome by Dr. Natasha Campbell-McBride.
    She is an advocate of meat eating (grasfed; organic), fermented foods (selfmade), and low-carb. She connects nutritional deficiencies with psychological diseases.
    She set up The Cambridge Nutrition Clinic.

    my story:
    I used to be skinny, have skin problems, problems with digestion and concentration, sleep problems.
    I suffered from stomach and duadonal ulcers last year and had to take antibiotics because of that.
    After that rollercoaster-ride I had chronic fatigue, low energy-levels, headaches and a constant pain in my right brest (think it’s the liver or the gall-bladder).

    my diet:
    eating organic meat, fish, or paultry. I consume it with some selfmade vegetable soup and fermented vegetables (in order to stimulate stomach acid production and support probiotic gut flora).
    Between the meals I eat raw vegetables (to get back alcaline).
    I try nuts from time to time, but it often ends in diharrea and the afore mentioned pain on the riht side. When I eat bitter tasting vegetables the pain usually goes away.
    I also drink a lot of herbal tea between meals.
    Can’t drink anithing cool (pain).
    Fruit has a paralizing effekt on me and makes me hungry and thirsty, same is for sweet vegetables. I try them from time to time but keep the quantities low.
    I stopped taking supplements and rather rely on high quality foods.

    on topic:
    I believe that good quality sources of animal fats and an adequate supply of Vitamins A and D is crucial for recovery, as well as a constant intake of probiotics. Of course it should be in a good ratio to antioxidants. Veggies + Meats = feeling good.

  83. David Barriga says:

    About 25 yrs. ago, I was 100% veggie guy, didn’t fit in with friends/family cause of my eating style. Was blessed spirtually and heathly by a elderly gal, provided a ton of natural healing methons. One day I asked her if I eat a little meat would it interfear with my veggie diet, she told me,’with all the long phyiscal work hrs. you need the protien from meat’, if you worked sitting down all day on a desk, no way, your body would not burn off the fat, she was right, I was trim and strong, average work day, 14 hrs. plus was active with teenaged sons, they had a hard time keeping up with me. So to me every one is different. appreciate all input, seems like the majoriety of people posting comments are open mined, thats good!

  84. Durianrider says:

    Kev makes a point I never even thought about!: THERE IS NOT A SINGLE HEALTH RETREAT ON EARTH THAT SERVES UP ANIMAL PRODUCTS AS A STAPLE!! THEY ARE ALL VEGAN/RAW VEGAN.

    Thanks for that Kev.

    PS: Great to see you supporting 30BaD on your FB profile man! Way to go! ;)

  85. Thomi says:

    “But does clearing acres of jungle to put up an organic coconut plantation fit into a vegan philosophy as well? How many animals are exploited here? How many died?”

    I’m a vegan and I don’t agree with clearing acres of jungle for anything including vegan friendly foods such as coconut. But the much bigger problem facing jungles is the clearing of them for cattle farming. This is much more common than clearing jungles for coconut plantations. So the real question should be does clearing acres of jungle for any type of food source fit into a vegan (or environmental) philosophy? Everyone should be concerned about this, including meat eaters, since cattle farming is the leading cause of deforestation in the Brazilian Amazon.

  86. Chris says:

    I agree with Anatol!

    People are pack animals and whatever the pack does is what they will do. . so when some became vegan.. others freely joined in. Now when some want to return to meat eating . . . others join in. No ‘thinking brain’ is being used here.

    Raw Vegan is the BEST diet in the world! It helps you get in touch with yourself and your emotions… and the planet.

    Gabriel is brilliant. I think he should have been a little more outspoken during his interview.. BUT … he also said very clearly “Its Not My Responsibility” and he’s right, its not. People can and will do to their bodies whatever they want. Fortunately I do have a thinking brain and I WILL remain a raw vegan because I have never felt better in my life and I’ve been vegan for 26 years.. It only gets better. Take some responsibility for your life.. and put forth some effort. It Is NOT difficult to do this. It is the easiest and the BEST diet in the world.

    Why is Brian Clement not in this line-up or Jameth Sheridan???? Where are the serious hard-core raw vegans???

    I was raised eating meat and dairy. I was never so sick in my life.. Thank you, NO thank you. I’m grateful to the plants, fruits and nuts/seeds that gave me my life back and allowed me to heal. I will never forget what I went thru. Choose to eat animal products at your own risk. . as Gabriel says… ‘not my responsibility.’

  87. oreganol says:

    I had never even though of the issue of eating egss v growing coconuts. But I suppose that to feed the chickens you also need to put aside land to grow food for the chickens, so that is affecting other animals. I’ll have to have a longer think about this one though.

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